Homeschooling Blessings & Challenges
JOY is a gift from God to strengthen us and isn’t dependent on our circumstances
God strengthened their family with hope, joy, and peace – after tragic death of their daughter to suicide. Tragedy is a part of the story, BUT NOT the whole story! Nancy’s mission is to encourage homeschool families and “to encounter things that bring JOY in life, remind us of the goodness of God, and shine a light on what is beautiful and good.”
This encouraging, hope-filled conversation with homeschool advocate and leader, Nancy Manos (nancymanos.com) will provide you with insights into:
- What are the amazing benefits, and challenges, of homeschooling?
- The dynamics of relationship building with our kids
- What can you do if you’re burned out homeschool parent, ready to give up?!
- The challenging journey of mental health and counseling/tools seemingly being helpful
- How God strengthened their family in the shock and aftermath of tragedy
- What a supportive homeschool and church family/community can look like during times of struggle and grief.
- How to support someone as they grieve a tragic loss – what is helpful, and what is not!
- How to balance the serious responsibility of being the sole educator of your children WITH the lack of control of the decisions they make as adults – they get to choose their adult life!
- How to choose transparency and a growth mindset in homeschooling instead of shame and isolation when things don’t turn out as you envisioned them to go.
- The importance of not forgetting about your marriage during homeschooling! Tips to connect with your partner/spouse so that you actually like each other when you have an empty nest one day…
- Reminder to seek, protect, and embrace joy daily.
To connect with Nancy visit: www.nancymanos.com
Video Transcript
Introduction
After years of loving support and mental health counseling, James and Nancy’s 23-year old daughter died by suicide. This honest, hope-filled conversation dives into the benefits and challenges of homeschooling. We talk about grief and community, and how God meets us in the hardest places and gives us the gift of joy to strengthen us through it all.
We first met in 2015. Gosh, ten years ago… when you graciously spoke to our local homeschool group on the topic of. And I looked it up because I was curious.
“Tips for homeschooling.” My family started homeschooling in 2011, and I had a seven and a four year old.
I was ready for some big time inspiration and rejuvenation at that time. When you came to speak with us and I remember being so inspired by your personal stories about your day to day learning adventures with your two beautiful daughters. From preschool through high school. This is such a fun story. I love how God brought us to homeschooling, and I remember coming to your house and I remember I don’t remember that particular talk what I talked about, but I remember that group of moms and how sweet it was to come and just be part of that. So thanks for inviting me.
How did you choose to homeschool your two daughters?
We were living in Minnesota. We were born and raised in Minnesota and spent 30 years there before we decided we did not like winter and then we moved here to where we’re like, we went from the frozen tundra to the surface of the sun in Arizona. But, we love it here. But at the time we were in a church raising our kids, and we met this family, that the wife also served in children’s ministry, which James and I both did.
And James was also an usher. So we just. And my husband was an usher. So James and Chris got to know each other, and Katie and I got to know each other, and we spent time with their family. Her girls were maybe two and four, one and three, two and four, very little, and there was just something really unique about their family.
It was so different from any family I had ever seen where they. There was this sweet connection in their family. Their boys were a few years older than our girls, and they were so respectful. And I remember going to their house for dinner and, you know, the boys would be like, how was your day, Mrs. Manos? Or they would ask James, you know, how was your work trip, Mr. Manos?
And I just thought it was so unusual. And so just in getting to talk with them, and getting to see their family dynamic and how they really enjoyed one another and, you know, they just it was a close family. They were homeschooling. And, you know, we hadn’t given a lot of thought to what we were going to do with our children’s education at that point, but just in spending time with them, it got us thinking and talking and, you know, and when James and I were talking about, well, what are we going to do with Olivia when she, you know, turns 4 or 5?
And the conclusion we came to was, our children are a gift from the Lord, and we’re accountable to him for how we raise them, for raising them. That’s a stewardship right to raise our children. And we thought it’s going to be a lot easier to stand before him one day and have had them with us, because we’re still accountable if they’re in someone else’s care all day.
So it just was very sweet to kind of just catch the vision for I was already really homeschooling, right? You’re teaching your kids their colors and how to, you know, tie their shoes when they get a little older and things like that. And so we just we were all in from the beginning, and then we moved to Arizona and continued homeschooling here.
The girls were five and seven when we moved, and we homeschooled them through graduation. So that’s beautiful. Yeah, that’s why we started as well. Was the relationship factor. Yeah. You know, we just to be able to spend that extra time in their life. Yes. You know, we weren’t planning on homeschooling and our daughter was very happily in preschool and kindergarten and grade one, and we’re, you know, she was she seemed like she was having the time of her life.
Sure. But she was bored and she wouldn’t share about the day. And every time we’d pick her up, she was like, you know, she didn’t have that joy of life. And, that’s when we decided to homeschool because we just wanted more family time. And I will say, as a nearing the end of our homeschool journey, I wish I could do it all over again.
Our kids are close. You know, normally with the age gap, our kids wouldn’t be. They wouldn’t even really know each other, really. Especially not even being in the same school at the same time. Like they’d be, you know, just passing in the night. So anyway, that was a sidebar. But no, I love going. Homeschooling has been such a blessing.
And, and Arizona is a great state to homes. It is a good state. Yes for sure. With many thanks to you and everyone involved with homeschooling and raising a family is wonderful and challenging at times. And yeah, yeah, it’s definitely not a picture perfect dream. There’s a lot of struggles and you know, as a homeschool parent, you never think you’re doing enough or the right thing.
Advice for a homeschool parent who is burned out and wants to quit?!
It can be quite challenging. You speak to families all over the nation about how they can be equipped for this valuable investment in the long run with their kids. What would you say to someone right now who might be ready to throw in the towel? Oh, don’t quit, don’t quit. The, I love there’s a meme that has made the rounds where there’s, like, two people digging for diamonds, and one is like a hair’s breath away from the breakthrough, and the other one has feet and feet to go to keep digging and the one that is so close to the reward turns and walks away when it gets hard.
Don’t quit because the breakthrough, the fruit of all of the labor that you have put in, all that you’ve invested, is just on the other side of kind of perseverance. And so I think sometimes the thing that I have found that helps really sustain you in those hard, it might be a hard day, but it also might be a hard week, a hard month, a hard year.
It could be a hard few years. I think especially like those pre-teen years, those were hard. Those are hard years. But having a vision for why you’re homeschooling, like, why did you choose to teach your children at home? It’s so much more than teaching math and grammar and science and reading and you know, all the things.
We want them to have a great academic experience. We want them to be, you know, critical thinkers and just have a good, well-rounded experience in education, right? So they’re equipped for life. But more than that, we want them to know and love the Lord.
Communication and Family Dynamics – Relationship Building
We want to have good family relationships. And I think we should ourself in the foot when we quit too early because especially if it’s an issue of, like maybe you’re, you’re having issues with a child that you’re butting heads with.
Olivia and I butted heads her whole childhood because she and I are almost identical in our type A firstborn. Personalities were strong opinions, you know, that kind of thing. But if it was that I wasn’t patient enough with her, sending her to school isn’t going to help me grow in patience, right? It’s just going to remove the opportunity to grow.
And so I just think, boy, if you can stick with those hard seasons, in homeschooling can be a gift. I think in some of those hard seasons. You know, I met a mom years ago whose mother was dying, and everybody around her was saying, put your kids back in school so you can take care of your mom.
And instead, they set aside their schoolwork and the whole family cared for grandma and. And the kids did not miss a beat. They they were ones that did standardized testing that didn’t. You know, it’s not required here in Arizona. But they did not lose any ground academically. But they had such a sweet experience. And so I think whatever’s going on in your family, in your life, you know, you and your spouse and, and the Lord have a chat and decide what’s good for you.
But I would say I have seen time and time again where God has been faithful and we have seen the rewards of persevering. Yeah. That’s excellent. And definitely what you said about, like, oftentimes our kids are almost like a mirror of our own places that we need to grow. Yeah. And become better people. And yeah, the hard things in life, in the day to day, they learn so much right by how you handle them.
You know, I’ll admit, you know, I’m an entrepreneur. I’ve been self-employed forever as a graphic designer, and my homeschool slash work balance has not been epic. It really has. It. It’s been hard, you know, financially and everything else. But our kids are watching to see. My parents kept going. My parents didn’t give up. They, you know, they were working till one in the morning to get a project done.
Like, sure, they’re watching more than what? Like our explicit curriculum is saying 100%. Yeah, it’s so true. I think there’s a reward. There’s a reward for hard work.
There’s a reward. We grow closer with our kids and with our with our husbands when we go through hard things together. And we’re turning to God and looking for answers and, you know, just his grace for the day.
Sometimes I think you’re right. Our kids are watching and they’re building their faith based on they’re watching us trust God in those hard moments. And the other thing, too, is, our ability to be humble. Yes. I’ve really learned that, you know, when I screw up, or maybe I’m having a bad day and I might say something that maybe didn’t come across the way I actually intended to be able to humble yourself and be able to stop in the moment and acknowledge it and, you know, and apologize.
And, you know, they receive it like they’re really appreciative. We are leading by example. And when we do wrong, we can pause and say, you know what? I’m really sorry that wasn’t there. You know, having a difficult day. Whatever. I apologize, and it’s so sweet because they always say, oh, that’s okay, mom. Apology accepted. Like, so be.
Yeah. Yeah. They teach us so much. What did you discover or learn during your homeschool days with your girls that shaped you and your family into who you are today, and kind of like your bond and your relationship with each other? I think a lot of it is just learning to trust God and to turn to him first.
And the fact that I was with my kids 24/7, except for Thursday nights, was Queen of the couch night. My husband, when he wasn’t traveling, he made it so that nobody could say, mom, I didn’t have to hear mom for like, you know, the evening of Thursday night, I got to put my pajamas on and lay on the couch and eat my favorite snacks and watch my favorite shows, and nobody could talk to me.
He put them to bed. I mean, he did that anyways. He was really great at like, bedtime stories and, you know, but just having time for me, but because they were with me all the time and he was working and traveling for his job, I think I it developed in me a desire to grow as a woman in my own character because I knew that, like their little sponges and their tape recorders.
And so if every time something is hard, you complain, you yell, you, you know, whatever you get impatient, you get frustrated. You’re teaching them that when things are hard, they should get frustrated and it’s okay to complain and you know, those things. And so I think it made me more aware of my own growth in my own walk with the Lord, my own maturity, because these beautiful daughters of mine were watching me all the time, how I interacted with my husband, how I spoke about other people, how I responded when things were hard or I didn’t want to do something and I was not perfect.
They didn’t. Anything they learned good was not necessarily for me, but it helped me to want to grow in my own walk, in my own maturity, because I knew, you know, it mattered. It mattered because they were with me. And the other aspect of that, too, is they’re also watching our relationships with our community. Yeah. And our friends.
And you know that we have a life outside of homeschooling or work. And, that’s really important to for them to see you engaging with others, you know, bringing meals to, you know, people in need. Her going through a hard time, you know, all of those things are things that they may not be able to observe in the day to day if they were away from the home.
Yeah. It’s so funny that you say that because, Alex, this was one of the funniest moments or sweetest moments to me was I’m always friendly. Like we go to the grocery store, we see the same person, you know, we go to the post office, whatever. I’m always asking people. I call them by name, ask them about their day.
If I remember they have a child or a grandchild or whatever. They were just on vacation. I ask them about that, right? And it used to drive my girls crazy. They were so embarrassed, especially in their teen years. Like, why is mom always talking to strangers? And then when Alex, our youngest, was in her late teens, she said, you know, mom, that used to bother me so much, but now I see that you care for people.
And it was so sweet to kind of have that get beyond herself and her own discomfort and kind of see that that’s how we’re supposed to be. We’re supposed to care for the people around us. And so it’s fun. It’s just fun. When that light bulb goes on for them, you’re like, oh, my mom’s not weird. That was actually was it might be weird.
In a good day, she’s weird in a good way. And then like, you know, they begin to sort of care about others too. Love for people is quite contagious in a really good way.
What is Joy?
So when I think of you, Nancy, it would be impossible not to think of the word joy. Oh, but not just because it’s how you sign your emails.
Joyfully, Nancy. Or you know, the fact that it’s on your website. Even without all of that, you exude joy on your website, it says so. Your mission is to encounter things that bring joy and life, remind us of the goodness of God, and shine a light on what is beautiful and good. I love that now. Joy is not, something that we create as just you and me.
I’m going to feel joy. What exactly is joy and what does it mean to you? That’s such a good question. It really is the core of who I am. But it joy is a gift to strengthen us. It’s a gift from God. And it isn’t based on our circumstance. You know, happiness is kind of circumstantial, situational. When things are beautiful and easy and happy and, you know, whatever.
But life is not like that. Like life is not problem free. I don’t have joy because I want the perfect childhood. My parents got divorced when I was young. You know, I, I’ve had so many difficult things in my life, but my joy is not dependent on my circumstance. My joy comes from the Lord. And so I love to look at joy this way.
Like joy is this treasure that God has given us. And it’s there to strengthen us. Like, I really believe that that joy is there to strengthen us in the hard times, not just when it’s going good. You know, you don’t really need joy on a great day, but you could you sure could use it on those, very difficult days.
But it’s like a treasure and it’s my responsibility to protect it. So you wouldn’t leave your front door open for a thief to come in and take whatever they want. And I feel like joy and God’s peace are that way, too. Like it’s my job. If I let my mind go to complaining or grumbling or things that are going wrong right now, then I’m opening the door to the enemy to come in and chisel away pieces of my joy and my peace.
And I refuse like that’s mine. That’s my gift from God. And so I’ve just seen God’s faithfulness and his goodness in the worst situations. And, you know, our story has some hard things in it, but I really believe that that God wants us to live life joyfully because we’re reflecting his goodness and his care and his love and his sacrifice in how we relate to people and how we live out our life.
And so that’s just I rest there in joy. I love that. Easier said than done, right? It sounds like it’s like you’re saying you have to seek it. I think you said somewhere that you were. Yeah, a joy hunter, that you were a hunter. That you would. You would look for the joy. Because especially in our world today, it’s easy to it’s easy to start looking like, I don’t mean to give up and start looking for that joy, but I’ve never really thought about it in that way before about protecting it.
That’s really interesting. Yeah, there’s that Bible verse about the renewal of your mind, like think upon the things that are good, that are worthy, that are, you know, Philippians four. That’s important to be able to renew our mind. We are training our thoughts. And I think it’s gratitude opens the door to joy when we are grateful. When we’re thankful.
So Heather Haupt is the one that taught me that job. Be a Joy Hunter idea. And there’s some questions you can ask yourself, like if your kids are squabbling, if it’s a rough day, if you’re frustrated, everybody’s crabby. Nobody’s getting anything done, whatever, whatever the situation is like, take a moment and ask yourself and ask your kids what’s going right.
How has God shown himself mighty on our behalf? You know what’s what makes you smile today? What’s going right in our homeschool? You know, whatever the question is like, just stop and go, okay, what? What is going well? What can we be thankful for right now in this moment? And I think it shifts your mindset. It helps you choose joy.
I know I’ve been on the phone with a friend and some situation was happening that was irritating me, and I started complaining about it and I went, you know what? Oh, that’s not going to help either of us. So right now I’m going to choose to see the positive in this situation, you know, that kind of thing and forgive a lot.
I think it’s amazing what we can do when we choose what we focus on. It’s almost like a muscle, you know, the more you practice it, you know, sort of being like a downer during the day, like really to go. Wait a minute. Yeah. Like the King and country song choose Joy. That just came into my mind.
Like choosing joy. You can dwell on the news. You can dwell in the weather. You can dwell. And you know the kids fighting in the other room. But to choose joy that is such an awesome reminder. I love that so much. So I’m going to I’m going to remember that as I continue my day today for sure. So as you said, joy is not dependent on our circumstances.
Challenges began with depression, anxiety, and suicidal thoughts
Would you be willing to share what happened on June 29th, 2017?
Yeah, so I’ll go back a little bit earlier. In 2008, James and I had arrived at a national conference, for homeschool leaders that I now actually get the privilege of running. I’m the conference director for the Alliance conference, and it’s a joy. But, we had arrived in Buffalo, New York.
We got a phone call. There was a message on my, a voicemail from our pastor when we landed, and he said, Alex has posted on Facebook that she wants to hurt herself. And, so we’re, we’re in Buffalo, New York, all the way across the country. We had to get a flight home the next day.
And so this is the first that we realized our daughter was dealing with depression and anxiety and suicidal thoughts. And so, we, since James had the week off, we were attending this conference. We took the kids and went to San Diego and had a family week and just decompressed and had this beautiful week together. We got into family counseling.
We had, you know, normal teen years, good, good teen years. Alex was an amazing person. But then to jump forward in 2017 at the age of 23, almost 24, she did commit suicide. And it was, the worst thing that I can imagine happening. And yet I always go right to this God is faithful and good.
So we did deal with some issues with depression and anxiety with her. We had her in Christian, a Christian counselor was working with her. She was planning for life. She had hope. She loved the tools that this counselor was giving her. And it just if I could vote for a different outcome, this is not the outcome I would want.
Because, she’s dear, but she was a believer, so, of course, we have peace. And we have hope, for the future. This is a temporary separation, but we’re coming up on eight years, and I miss her every day. So, so mental health issues, depression, anxiety are part of our culture. I think it has a lot to do with, like, there’s all that.
We won’t go into all the things, but the chemicals and the processed foods and all the things in our world that are not lending to health are not helping. But you, we did everything that we could that we knew to do. Sure, there’s things I wish I had done differently, but, we got her help, and she even saw her counselor that day that she died.
And so, in the midst of the worst, the worst thing that I hope I ever experience, God was right there. Faithful. Good. Brought peace to our home in the midst when you couldn’t do anything but cry. You know? For the person who might be watching this, you know, it’s a that’s a very scary thing.
You did everything that you could possibly do. And yet the outcome was still not something you had control over. Right. That’s a very, very scary thing. It is. And without faith, without God, there isn’t really much to hope for. No. Could we have any hope? I can’t imagine going through regular life without the Lord, but going through trauma and tragedy.
You know, James was in Connecticut on a work trip when she died, and it was one week before the homeschool convention here in Arizona that I was running at the time. I ran it for eight years, and one of my great joys in life is event planning and serving homeschool families. But, she had come to my office that night, about 1030 at night.
Well, she had asked me the day before, can I go see my counselor tomorrow? I need an extra session. I’m like, absolutely whatever you need, make the appointment. And she came home from that, took a nap, and then she came down about 1030 at night. It was just the two of us at home. And she said, she said, mom, I’m going to go to my friend’s house.
And I’m like, oh, don’t go out. I’ll quit working because I was still working all the convention prep stuff, you know, it was a lot. And it just it was, I remember she gave me a hug. I love you, mama. I can still hear those words in her voice. And she left. And, you know, we don’t need to get into.
I don’t mind sharing the story, but nobody needs, you know, we don’t need to have the downer of the negative story, but it was really. It was a bad breakup with an ex-boyfriend. And I got a call from his mom, and a half hour later, 40 minutes later. Come quickly. Alex is hurt herself. And what? I didn’t know it was already dead at that point.
I’m so thankful that this mom called me and I. I didn’t have a policeman come to my door. I got to go. I didn’t see her. I’m thankful for that. And then our older daughter, Olivia, and her husband and our two year old grandson, Hartford, all came right over. But then I had to call James in the middle of the night, wake him up with this.
Worse news, and I, I mean, in the moment, I just I was like, Alex is dead. I couldn’t even, like, form kind words or cushion it in any kind of way because it was so raw. And the policeman was so kind. He talked to James and the whole AFHE board came to the house. And spent the whole night with me until James could get on a flight and get home that next day.
But we’re so thankful that we had a community around us to love us, to care for us. The convention was amazing and hard. You know, I got to be with the 5000 people that I had been working to serve all year. And, and we got love down a lot, which was so sweet and so needed.
You know, we needed care. But it also gave me something to focus on that wasn’t my own grief. You know, I could go serve other people for a few days, and that was a gift from God. But what I have seen when the worst happens, when like as a believer, you want to think I will always get the answer I want.
It’s not true. We live in a fallen world. Awful things happen. But God is good and God is faithful and he walks with us. And so that’s if there’s anything I want people to hear is that God didn’t do this. He didn’t cause this. He didn’t. You know, he’s not out there causing car accidents and giving people cancer.
And he’s just not. But he walks with us. What? I want a different outcome, of course. But you know what? She’s in the most perfect place. And it would be selfish for me now to want her back. You know?
As a lot. But I just. I hope it encourages someone to know that when things don’t go, you know, because we stood in faith for years that God would deliver her from those thoughts, from depression. And it didn’t end up the way we wanted. But he’s still so good.
It’s almost too unbelievable to understand. And this. Yeah, you’re in it, right? Like the peace that that passes all understanding how he gave you the strength to put one foot after the other and follow through with that convention. That was the year Chad and I were taking photos at AFI. That’s right. They were the student I.D. photos. You know, it was no secret.
You guys told everyone that this had happened. But, you know, the convention was continuing as planned. And, I just remembered seeing you there the next day. Sorry, I didn’t even bring Kleenex, but I just remember seeing you, and it was really hard to not express emotion or, like, see anything. Right? But there was a level of, a respect.
The floodgates are closed right now. We’re just going to hold back the flood, okay? We’re just going to. But like, you know, put one foot in front of the other, we’re going to do our job and this is going to be amazing for all these homeschool families that are coming from all over the state, you know, who might not even know you or the board or anyone who are just coming there to get inspired and fed and filled up.
So, I don’t know, I feel like at that time, like you taught a lot of people I don’t know, like almost how to continue living you didn’t hide it. You know, you were very public about it. You know, you shared really, you shared your heart on Facebook and everything else for us all to see. And I, I can speak personally that by watching the your strengths that you got that you and James and your family got from God was, it’s a lesson I’ll never forget.
This never left me. You had wrote:
This is devastating. But we are not devastated. This is heartbreaking. But we are not broken. This is crushing. But we are not crushed. This is shattering, but we are not shattered. This is a dark road, but we have light. This is dreadful. But we are not full of dread or fear. This is overwhelming.
– Nancy Manos
But we will not be overwhelmed and consumed by despair.
That’s what I think of whenever I think back. Yeah, that’s so encouraging to me. Whenever people share because I decided I wasn’t going to live in shame. You know, I think some often when you’re in leadership, if you’re in, you know, in a church, if you’re a homeschooler, like, you don’t want people to see your stuff, you don’t want to know that like real life happens to people.
And this is awful. I mean, it was horrible. And there’s a lot of judgment and stigma with mental illness and suicide and things like that. But I just decided we were going to be transparent from the beginning because there’s no shame in someone struggling. You wouldn’t blame someone for having cancer or a disease, but, you know, just that I just decided that this happened to us and it wasn’t anything we did or didn’t do or, you know, whatever.
It just it’s part of our story. And I didn’t want to hide from it, and I didn’t want to be ashamed of it. And so plus the enemy made me mad. And I just in that moment, within about a week, I actually said this to James. A week later, I said, you know, it’s amazing to me in the worst situation we’ve ever experienced, the worst thing that’s ever happened to us, God is exactly who he is.
We’ve always known him to be. He’s a good father. And, I just this righteous anger rose up in me and I thought, I will not let the enemy steal one more thing from me. And he didn’t. When she’s a believer, she’s in heaven. There’s no victory for the enemy here. But in our loss, I thought, I don’t want to ever be in strife with other people.
I don’t want to let discontent creep into my life, like all the ways that the enemy wants to distract us and disturb us and get us off course. I just decided in that moment. Now, I’m not perfect. I certainly, you know, it’s not about perfection, but it was a choice in that moment. Like, I’m going to press in to my Heavenly Father who has us under his wing.
You know, we were safe and cared for and loved, and we didn’t have to be shaken or destroyed by this really horrible thing. And so I just I don’t know if it’s just me and my personality, you know, whatever.
But I just decided we were going to love people. Well, we were going to live with excellence. We were not going to stop living because we suffered this great tragedy.
That’s a very brave. Is very brave, sure. And took great strength, which, again, I’m sure you and James couldn’t just muster up on your own. But that’s not a strength. And bravery came from God. It’s a supernatural strength. It is well, and you know, it comes from walking with the Lord, too. Like the word that you plant in your heart.
Grieving and Community Love and Support
It’s there when you need it, right? So spending time in the word, training our minds towards holiness, towards walking with the Lord, you know, those kind of things. So when you do suffer something, I mean anything can happen to anybody at any time, right? So where are you going to find God in the midst of that? I’ve never blamed God.
I’ve never been mad at God. But he could handle it if I was right. Just big enough. He’s got big shoulders, but there’s just something about our walk with the Lord. All the things that we’ve put into our hearts and our minds over the years. He’s there. He’s ready when we need him in those awful, awful moments, you know?
And that just gives me such hope. Like, it’s not like we’re we get saved and things are beautiful and flawless and sunshine and rainbows. There’s no unicorns, right? So. So what do we do in this messy, fallen world? To love the Lord and live this life that he’s given us? You know, he gives us gifts and, time.
And how do we serve and love others? Well, and, I don’t know, I just I’m inspired to live. And it doesn’t mean that it wasn’t painful. There were days that I could not stop crying, and I just. There were days that honestly, the two hardest things were looking at my husband. And we didn’t avoid each other, but there was, you know, there’s an intimacy there that we lost this together.
And there were days where I was like, please don’t look at me right now. It’s, oh, look, I wasn’t in worship at church. That was the other place. That’s another place of intimacy where we would just sob and sob and people loved on us and knew what we were going through. And it was okay. I was okay crying in church, you know?
But it was hard to be willing to, like always feel it so deeply. So I can smile now. I can talk about her without crying. But it wasn’t like that at the beginning. You know, it was hard. You had written, and I think this is important for people to hear whenever I reflect on the death of her daughter or any hard thing we go through, I always come back to the truth of how good and faithful God is.
He never leaves us or forsakes us. He walks beside us on our best days and on our worst. He is not the author of the horrible things we experience. Tragedy, calamity and illness are not his will for us. Depression, anxiety and suicide were not God’s plan for our daughter. The enemy came to steal, kill and destroy. But Jesus came that we might have life and life more abundantly.
I can rest in knowing that God is good and he is faithful. We live in a fallen, broken world, but he is for us and we are not alone. That’s one of the biggest questions that people have about God. If God so great, why is there so much evil in the world? Why do bad things happen? You know, I’m checking off all the happy Christian boxes.
Why is this happening to me? We don’t like to hear that, but it’s true. Know who would? Yeah, yeah. It’s not really a sales pitch, right? Yeah. Yeah, but I just want the viewer to hear that. That God is not the author of these things, but God is with us in the hard things. Yeah. And, I think that is the important point here.
We really need him. We really need. I absolutely do. You know, it reminds me, Karen, there was a moment about ten days after Alex died. I’m standing in my kitchen. I was home alone. I don’t know where James was that evening that I could not stop crying. And I have a friend who is, just, you know, you have those one friends that they just.
The word oozes out of them. And what you hear is Jesus when they talk and I so I called this friend and I said, could you just pray the word over me? Because everybody wants to say something encouraging, you know, and I appreciated everybody’s kindness. I still miss it when I encourage somebody who’s suffered a loss. I don’t always know what to say, but I was just like, I was done with people giving me their opinion.
I needed God’s word. And she just prayed over me for like 25, 30 minutes. Reminded me, you know, you’re a good mom. God loves you. Alex was well loved. You know, she just spoke life over me. And I laughed. And I said, Christina, it’s like the there’s a presence of peace in our home. And she laughed with me and she goes, well, Nancy, that’s Jesus.
He himself is your piece. And I was like, oh, of course I know this. But I had forgotten that he’s a person and he’s there with us. So it just that was such a beautiful moment of God reminding me I’m here with you. I don’t want this for you. I didn’t want this for her. But, you know, here’s the thing, too, is these things are part of our story.
But it’s not the whole story, right? There’s so much beauty and so much blessing and so much goodness. I don’t want to live in the despair of the loss. I want to live in the joy of the gift of this life and the faithfulness of our good God. Absolutely. I’ve spoken to other people who have experienced great loss, and I think we can learn as people who love each other well.
Advice for those supporting others who are grieving right now?
Do you have any advice either to families who are walking through this right now, or for those that are loving and supporting these families, they do well, I would say be present. What Minister ministered to me the most was someone just even a text I love you, I’m thinking about you today. That meant the world. Because what happens is when someone, when you suffer a loss, everybody rallies around the first weeks, you’re you’re cared for and loved and supported, and then people get back to their life as they should.
I mean, life goes on. But you’re still sitting there in your pain and trying to figure out your new normal. What does life look like beyond this tragedy? And maybe you’re not even there yet. Maybe you’re just trying to get out of bed and put one foot in front of the other. You’re in that kind of, you know, the really, really raw moments of the early days.
So I would say, like one thing that really has blessed me is over the months that come over the years, you know, even just a text, it doesn’t have to be anything. That takes a lot of time. But just, I’m thinking about you. I love you. Makes a world of difference. Okay, well, this was a blessing to, you know, because again, week before convention, I reached out, I sent out a, Facebook post, I think, and asked for volunteers to come to my house.
So I had like 20 people in my house for a week, and people would show up with food. The thing that I thought is going to crumble, crush me right now is dealing with the food in my fridge. You know, when people bring like, more deli meat and buns. Awesome. But as I had a friend that drove like 45 minutes every day, she was a fellow board member.
But she came to my house every day and she, just, without saying a word to me, took care of the food, what needed to what was needed to be frozen, given away, disposed of because it was going bad or whatever. So she came every day for a week. So, like, those little practical things just show up, you know, whatever within the person’s comfort zone.
Because sometimes, like, I would have loved somebody to come and just mark my flowers or clean my bathrooms, but I don’t want somebody doing my laundry, you know, so kind of have to suss out where’s their comfort zone with you helping them. But practical things help DoorDash gift card, drop off a meal, whatever. The thing that I would say don’t do.
And I have a hard time with this myself because I’ve suffered a loss. This is my immediate thought is, oh, I know how you feel. You know what? Don’t rush to process someone else’s grief through your the filter of your own experience. I had a mom say, I know exactly how you feel. My husband died five years ago and I’m like, you have no clue.
You know, I know you’ve suffered loss, but. And in the moment, I can empathize with someone else for having a loss. But I’m in the I’m in the throes of dealing with my own stuff. I can barely breathe, let alone empathize with you right now. So I would say, just don’t rush to, you know, filter someone else’s loss through your experience because it in a way, it feels like it’s taking away.
So now you’re talking about your person you lost. And I’m just trying to deal with the fact that I’ve lost mine. You know, so that that was a kind of eye opening thing. And I realize that I do that myself, and I’ve tried to be much more careful, about I don’t say to somebody who suffered a loss, even if it’s a similar somebody who’s lost a child to suicide.
I don’t say when Alex died, because then it’s turning it about me. I just want to say I’m so sorry that you’re going through that, and I can pray for them and whatever, but those are kind of my to, like, be present and remember them for months to come. And then maybe just kind of just listen, you know, the best thing you can do is, if they’re open, share a memory about your loved one.
You know, what’s something that you really, you know, a favorite memory with them and let them talk about the person they’ve lost. That’s really good advice. When something does happen to someone we care about, and we want to say all the right things and do the right things, but often things just come out because we want to help.
But it’s good to know what actually is helpful. And I’ve heard that before as well from other people who have shared that just honestly, even if he don’t even say anything and are just there and presence, our homeschool community is tight. Yeah. And which is beautiful and incredible. It’s an incredible gift and also very hugely supportive. If you are isolated and didn’t have your church community or your homeschool community, you probably wouldn’t have as much food going rotten in your fridge.
You’d be very much alone, so it can be a beautiful blessing, but also something that has been, coming into my attention recently.
Pressures, Burdens, Public-Appearances
The burden of outcome or public appearance. When you homeschool, you’re taking on a very heavy responsibility for your kids. You know, there’s no one else to point the finger at, like, oh, that fifth grade teacher, you know, they really they really did a number.
It’s not that we intend to do it, but we do. So we put on this sort of backpack of responsibility in our own minds about how our kids turn out as adults and when they turn out great, we want to pat ourselves in the back, maybe, and be like, oh, phew, well, that worked out great. You know, thank you, God, for, you know, making my kids turn out to be the perfect adults I imagined when they were five years old.
But when they make choices that are not healthy or go against the values and morals of their upbringing, there’s a tendency to either feel like hiding, like getting out from under the microscope of the homeschool community and then like shutting everyone to us. What have you heard from other homeschool families who might be dealing with this right now?
Because it’s a very it’s a very sensitive subject that no one really talks about. It is well and I’ll tell you, even depression and suicide, I didn’t know how prevalent it was in the homeschool community until my daughter died. And I had homeschool parents and leaders reaching out to me from across the country. Speakers that I had met like one time.
Pray for my daughter. She’s, you know, we’re on suicide watch again. And I love to pray for people, but I do think we can naively think that homeschooling is going to save our children. And it’s not. The only savior we have is Jesus. And what homeschooling does is it gives you an opportunity to pour into your kids, to build relationships, to, you know, disciple them to know and love the Lord.
But they still have to choose that. And, you know, sometimes they push away from our beliefs. Sometimes, you know, things happen. They need somebody and they’re drawn into, you know, the gamut of things. And then, of course, there’s a whole bunch of kids who are, you know, love the Lord and are raising their own families now. They are married and have children, and they’re raising them to know God.
And so I guess we can’t hold. Homeschooling is not the standard we live by, right? It’s just an it’s a choice that gives us opportunities we wouldn’t have if they were away from us all day. And we do take the lion’s share of the responsibility for their education and their upbringing. But really, it’s about them making choices.
To, you know, am I going to choose to follow Jesus as a grown up? You know, they have to have their own faith. The thing is, I would say we never stop praying for them. You know, Alex had a boyfriend she was living with after she graduated from high school, and we did not support this. But she was a grown up, and we had taught her right and wrong.
We she knew the word. She was, serving in church, you know, she was still she loved the Lord, but but she was figuring things out, and she made choices that we didn’t always agree with. But I think we need to not live in guilt and shame. I think that’s the enemy. The enemy wants you to feel accused and shameful.
And where we need to repent to our children. You know, I feel like I kind of got in on that wave in the early 2000 where it was very, raising perfect children, which never really is a thing that’s even possible. But I probably was a little dogmatic. And we’re not going to watch these shows. We’re not going to listen to that music.
We’re going to not get involved with worldly things. And my kids have kind of pushed back a little bit in their adult years as far as like, yeah, well, we are going to listen to this music or things that I wouldn’t necessarily choose, but I think I was trying to protect them from the world, from evil things, and in some ways that can feel very restrictive or whatever.
And so I think we do our best with each day that you were given and know that there are unique individual and they get to make a choice, they get to choose how they live their adult life. And we pray that the fruit, the seeds that we planted would bear fruit, that they would come back to the truth of that they that they know that they were taught about who God is, and that they would walk with him all their life, you know.
And so I think we just have to be okay in knowing if I failed, I repent, if I if I went too far or if I was off track, like repent to the Lord, repent to your kids if you can. I’ve apologized to Olivia for a number of things. She’s forgiven me. I was too strict in some ways.
Thankfully, I didn’t stay there their whole childhoods, but. But there was a season where I was way too strict. But she goes, well, mom, there were times I was a brat and I wasn’t real respectful to you. So we both kind of see our own flaws and failings, and we’ve forgiven each other. They’re their own people. We can’t feel like we failed or succeeded because of how they turned out.
Like we have to just go. I did my best. I honored this stewardship. And what happens now is between them and the Lord. And that can be really heartbreaking if they’re choosing hard things, bad things, wrong things, things we know aren’t the best for them, but we love them anyways.
Like I, I love my daughters no matter what.
If I disagree with something in their adulthood, that’s not it’s not my business. I don’t have to have an opinion about everything. I can love them.
Curriculum is a tool, but it’s not THE answer.
But you know, when you go to homeschool conventions, I don’t know when you see all the shiny new curriculum and all the speakers and all their wonderful things. Every year you get filled up with this, like you know, it’s like a little fire is rekindled, like, oh, yeah, you know that.
That’s what I need to do. This is what, you know, we need to focus on this year, and this is going to fix everything. But it’s really not. It’s really not the curriculum. It’s, you know, the relationship. And just I think the openness that we talked about earlier, like being able to really communicate with one another, whether we agree or, you know, we’re off base or we’re you know, trying to control we really don’t have control.
And for someone who’s like, you know, Type-A, like I am, you know, giving up control is really, really hard. That’s like a daily release. Try every single day. Yeah. Because there is no perfect. It’s always fun listening to new homeschool moms at the beginning of their journey and experience. In hindsight, you know, you hear people talking and they have so much hope in all of their curriculum, like all the the daily tasks and all of the things that they’ve set into place and all the the right extracurricular activities, it’s like we have to be careful not to make that an idol.
That’s right. Curriculum is a tool. It’s a tool in your tool belt that you get to use as you raise and educate your children. It’s not your master. It’s not. It’s not the answer. You know, Jesus is the only answer. Yeah. There’s, a podcast. I don’t know if you know, if it’s still on, but it was called, homeschooling IRL.
And then we have it. Yeah. Homeschooling in real life. Their biggest thing was about hope shifting. Like, don’t place your hope in anything but God. Like, don’t place your hope on the debate club. Don’t place your hope even on your churches. Youth group. Yeah, that’s right. There’s only one place to shift or hope to. And you know, that’s God.
Honor Your Marriage ! One day, the nest will be empty.
Yeah. The one thing that I would add to that, Karen, is, honor your marriage. Like, make your marriage a priority. Because I’ve heard of so many couples that they get to the end of their homeschool career and they’re ending up divorced. And it’s so heartbreaking to me. It’s easy to make your kids the priority because you’re.
I mean, it’s 24 seven job. You’re not only their mom, you’re also their teacher. And you’re responsible for their full education. There’s nobody else to do. You and your husband. Right? But I think we can get things out of order when we put make our kids the priority and we have nothing left for husbands. And and I’m not saying that’s the reason that marriages end, but I’m saying don’t let years go by where you do not prioritize your marriage, and then you find out, I mean, if you have ten children, you might be homeschooling for 30 years.
I don’t know, you could be homeschooling a long time, but at some point they’re all going to be gone, and it’s going to be you and your husband. And what kind of relationship do you want to have at the end? I will say James and I had some lots of hard years. We didn’t always like each other, but here we are.
We’re empty nesters. For the first time in 34 years, because my dad lived with us until he died a year ago. And so like, we always had somebody with us a parent, children, adult children, you know, like somebody has lived with us our whole married life. And we are so happy. Like we like each other. We enjoy watching movies and cooking together and playing card games and, you know, like going for walks and things like, we’re enjoying this season.
But it’s because we were intentional about making sure that our marriage was a priority. And I just hate to see families fall apart because we get our priorities wrong. That is very important. As a side note, I love how you call James, Mr. Manos, Mr. Manos, Mr. Manos and I like you. So funny. You guys are an amazing couple.
So what would be some tips? I think one, we have to realize the weight of the responsibility that we’ve taken on when we homeschool. And acknowledge it is a huge commitment. It is a lot of work. It’s not always easy. I mean, we’re with small people all day and they’re not always easy. And you’re still you. All your flaws and idiosyncrasies, all of it.
You’re still you bring all your stuff to the table. And so I think acknowledge that and make space for, I don’t know if I love the word self-care, but we need to take care of ourselves. You know, it’s kind of the put your own oxygen mask on first. We we cannot pour out everything and then have nothing left where we’re I mean, we’re inviting illness into our bodies if we are physically burnt out, if we’re not taking care of ourselves like I, I’m on a journey right now to lose 40 pounds.
I’m 15 pounds down. But I wish I could go back 30 years and have prioritized my physical health while I was serving others. You know, my family, the homeschool community, church. I didn’t take care of my physical body. I’m almost I’m 57. I just turned 57. And I wish I could go back. So like take, take today and make sure you’re doing something.
Go out and see the sunshine, get some fresh air, go for a walk, take your kids with you. If you have to. You know we have children. We can’t necessarily just. I’m going for a walk. You know, if they’re older, you can. So I think there’s something about taking care of yourself and then making time for your spouse, where you’re not talking about the kids or the finances or, you know, whatever your responsibilities, make some fun.
Sometimes for us, we didn’t date. We didn’t we didn’t do the take the advice and go on a weekly date. But, you know, we played a lot of board games with our kids. We had laughter in our home, like we made sure we were having fun. You should have fun as a family that also decompresses when things are hard.
And then I told you about Queen of the couch night. Like James made sure I had an evening that was just me and nobody could say mom for a few hours. I didn’t have to feed them. I didn’t have to. You know, I wasn’t responsible. And that refreshed me. If you wait for those breaks, you know, if you’re always thinking, like, okay, I need a vacation to be okay, there’s not enough vacations in the world to refuel you.
So we also need to find ways in our day. You know, maybe it’s that for an hour, everybody goes to their room. I don’t care if you read. Do something quiet in your bed. You know, play blocks on the floor. Mom gets a break for an hour. You guys are having quiet time. It’s good for all of us.
Maybe you need to just do that, to keep your sanity. Teach your kids to how to cook, how to clean, how to do laundry, get them involved in helping run your house. Because if you’re also trying to do all those jobs and be the teacher and be the chauffeur and be the, you know, all the things, you’re not going to have time or energy or even interest in anything else.
You know, time with your husband. So be aware and find ways. If you have five kids, six and under, you’re in a busy, intensely parenting season. In that season, what can you do to have a little peace today? You know, and refuel yourself. And so look for ways. Talk to your husband. What can we do together to make sure I don’t lose my mind?
Really? Because your husband is your best friend, right? They want to help you. So we should. We should be in this together. I love that advice. That is super important because your marriages definitely are struggling as well.
Single Moms CAN Homeschool Their Kids
But as a side note to single moms out there, you know, I also know a lot of single moms who are successfully homeschooling their kids today.
Please know that you can do this. You can absolutely do this, especially in our post-Covid world where more and more people are working from home.
Current Plans and Joy-Filled Activities
Nancy, where are you finding your joy today? I know you’re always doing something fun, whether you’re cooking or gardening. Well, you know, it’s interesting because I retired from AFHE, which is Arizona Families for Home Education, our statewide homeschool organization here in Arizona.
After 16 years with the organization, I retired in 2020, and I kind of held my hands out and said, okay, God, what do you want to do with what do we do in this next season? With all my years of experience, my love for the homeschool community, you know, those kind of things and, James asked me to take a year off to say nothing.
No, not to say yes to anything. But when end up happening, there’s this conference that we attended, for leaders of statewide homeschool organizations. I was, asked to run it. This is my third year as the director, and so it’s so neat because I attended it. We started going in 2005. And now I get to serve state leaders in this beautiful way.
I love event planning. Event planning fuels my it like it floats my boat in a really big way. I love all the minutia. I love the spreadsheets, and then I love creating space for people to come together. And so I get to take all my years of experience planning and running the homeschool convention here to run this national conference now, and, so I love that I do podcast marketing for like, Zan Tyler’s Homeschool podcast, and I get to serve other people in that way in the marketing space.
I do graphic design. You and I share that in common. And so I get to use my gifts and, experience in lots of fun ways, but probably, you know, and those things give me joy on the daily. I love spending time with my grandchildren. We have two grand boys that are now almost seven and ten, which I can’t even believe.
My daughter’s 33. And I’m like, well, I was just 30 something. How do I do that? And then it possible. So and they live in Northern California, so we don’t get to see them all the time. But when we do, it is a treat doing FaceTime calls with them. But I do love gardening and quilting and cooking and, just enjoying life.
I’m I probably am way too busy. I’m the, women’s ministry director at my church, and I just I love to serve. I love to make space for other people to have an encounter, to build community, to encounter God. To be refreshed. Like those things that gives me joy. Well you didn’t you don’t have much clean of the couch time right now and not much.
No, but, you know, you’re filling other people’s cups. You’re serving. You know, this is your purpose. And I love that you’re finding joy in it and walking in it. Where can people find your homeschool resources and encouragement and find out more about your many speaking topics and workshop events? Well, my website Nancymanos.com. I wish that I had time to blog.
I have so many ideas. I have articles started. I don’t have a ton of content on my website as much as I’d like, but there are some great homeschool articles and then also, just encouragement if you want to read more about our story and Alex’s, life and death and the hope that we have. There’s some articles about that.
And then I have some free resources on my that just it’s funny because it’s a, it’s a lead magnet. Sign up for my email list and you’ll get these great things I never email. I have dreams one day of doing is providing encouragement through my email marketing. But, right now I’m serving other people, so. But yeah, I’ve got great.
I do love to speak at events. I just spoke in Canada in Minnesota this year and it was such a treat. Can I share one quick story? Absolutely. At the end. So I was this was my first time being a keynote and in Toronto and I loved it. The people there were amazing and lovely and it was such a fun opportunity.
At the idea of six talks. At the end of my sixth talk, which was on organizing your homeschool, like, organization, not just your physical space, but also like your schedule and your routines and things. This mom and her two year old little boy came up to me, and she said he has something to say to you.
Is that okay? And I’m like, absolutely. And he got down and he was just darling. And he goes, I just want to say, you’re really good teacher. Oh, it melted my heart. It was like Jesus himself said, good job. But it’s so fun to me, you know, because I spend so much time at my computer, I’m always on zoom calls and doing, you know, project management from my desk.
And to get out and get to encourage moms and dads in the homeschool journey and to share practical ideas for, like, how to make it hands on, learning and fun and engaging. I love those things, but I just love this. I love watching moms and dads choose to bring their children home and to raise them and to educate them and it’s such a beautiful thing.
And it fills my cup to get to go and encourage others. So if there was one takeaway that you would want someone to remember about your story, what would it be? Oh, God is faithful and good and joy is a gift to strengthen you. Like, those are kind of my I think about them all the time I live.
I walk that out like God is for you. Jesus died on the cross and he bore every sickness and disease like he made a way so we could be restored to the father. Our sin, the price we owe has been paid. It’s something we can never pay for. And so I just think what a gift this life is.
We don’t know how much time we have. You could be hit by a bus tomorrow. I mean, things happen, right? So what are we doing with today? Like, that’s. My God is so good, and he’s given us such an opportunity that I go live it to the fullest, love people well, serve where you can. Like, just be present and make the most of this day and enjoy the gift of life like that.
That’s probably my key takeaway. I know I’m going to carry that with me every day. I’m just going to write Joy and keep it on my computer monitor. Thanks for having me. This is I love what you’re doing and I’m so encouraged by it. And it’s such a treat to be invited. Oh thank you Nancy, I, I really appreciate I know we had to reschedule bunch of times, but it’s such a blessing to be able to share this time with you.
Truly. We’ll have to get together in real, real life. Yeah, these though, and let’s do it.
Closing prayer
But yes, father, we just thank you. Thank you for the opportunity to teach our children at home and to raise them up to know and love you. Thank you for the gift of community. Thank you, father, for, just walking with us and to help us grow.
And, father, I just pray for every person listening, whatever they’re going through, whatever season of life, father, that they would find joy today, that they would choose joy when things are hard. Father God, that you would just, the presence of peace would fill their home. And, I just pray blessings on Karen and the podcast and all that she’s doing to share beautiful stories of hope.
And father, that you just you have a plan for each family. And when things are hard, we can cling to you. We can turn to you. You are the creator of the universe. You have creative solutions. You are a safe place where we can rest. And, that you are an anchor in the midst of, waves that want to toss us around.
We can be rooted and grounded in you. And so we just thank you for the gift of this day and pray. Blessings on every listener in Jesus name, Amen. That is beautiful. Thank you. Nancy.